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(Complaint regarding actions of User:ASDamick as sysop)
(Invitation to a Conversation)
 
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== Complaint regarding actions of [[User:ASDamick]] as sysop  ==
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== Changes for the morning of May 11, 2016 ==
 
 
I would like to add my voice to those unhappy with [[User:ASDamick]] functioning as a sysop. In a recent disagreement with me, he has misused his position as a sysop by attempting to arbitrate (of course, in his favour) the dispute, leaving a very high-handed message on my talk-page. That is to say, he has been using his powers as a sysop to arbitrate a dispute in which he was involved. He clearly has done so as an act of retaliation within the context of our dispute, at a time whilst he had lost his temper and was not in the right frame of mind to perform duties as a sysop.
 
 
 
Here, essentially, the point is that a sysop should not act as judge of his own dispute; he should not misuse his position as a sysop to score points within a dispute he is having; and he should not perform tasks of a sysop when he has lost his temper. And although I have only been editing on OrthodoxWiki for a short time, this is not the first time I have seen him act in this way. Previously when he was in dispute with [[User:Cebactokpatop]] (with whom I certainly have no allegiance) he acted in exactly the same manner, leading you to overturn some of his actions. Therefore, I appeal to you to bring him into line.
 
 
 
I am not asking for him to have his status as a sysop revoked, but for you to make clear to him:
 
 
 
* Not to use his status as a sysop within a dispute in which he is engaged;
 
* Not to use his status as a sysop to arbitrate over disputes in which he is engaged; and
 
* Not to function as a sysop when he has lost his temper.
 
 
 
Moreover, I have seen [[User:ASDamick]] acting in a very high-handed way towards [[User:lxthis888]]. This only alienates people, needlessly. Please could you direct him not to talk down to others, clearly to others to whom he feels himself superior. I say this, because I appreciate the interjections I have seen you make in the past, which have been genuinely irenic and for the good of Orthodoxwiki. (I include here the interjection you made calling for me to be more careful with my language, which certainly put me back on track at the time.) [[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] 22:43, May 23, 2008 (UTC)
 
 
 
Thanks for your response. I'd like to ask you directly - do you think it is appropriate for [[User:ASDamick]] to arbitrate over disputes in which he is personally involved? [[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] 01:41, May 24, 2008 (UTC)
 
 
 
: Just as a comment:  I'm not "arbitrating over disputes."  I'm saying, "Stop acting like a jerk.  It's not cool."  I don't care who does it to whom, even if the recipient might deserve it.  My general approach is simply to comment and talk with people I feel are getting out of line.  Only in what I regard as extreme a repeated incivility do I take action by making use of sysop privileges, and that only when the incivility is directed toward more than just me.
 
 
 
: Heck, I don't even know what the supposed "dispute" in question is!  I thought we were discussing what the best name for the article was and suddenly found myself the target of Yet Another Theory about hidden agendas, etc.  I should start notching my user page for every time I get one of those.  :)  &mdash;[[User:ASDamick|<font size="3.5" color="green" face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">Fr. Andrew</font>]] <sup>[[User_talk:ASDamick|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/ASDamick|<font color="black">contribs</font>]] <font face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">('''[[User:ASDamick/Wiki-philosophy|THINK!]]''')</font></small> 02:56, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
 
 
 
::Good points, Fr. Andrew. — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk])
 
 
 
Fr John, just one more question - do you think it appropriate for a sysop and priest to call someone a "jerk", or do you regard such name-calling as incivil? It's a straightforward question, and I'd appreciate a straightforward answer.
 
  
[[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] 11:48, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
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You're probably still working on this, but it looks like the changes I made to pages this morning were lost.  A couple of them were minor, but I did a significant wikification/edit of one of the pages [[Bulgarian Eastern Orthodox Diocese of the USA, Canada and Australia]].  Any chance this can be restored?  (P.S.  Thank you for all your hard work!) [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 18:05, May 11, 2016 (UTC)
  
: Just to be clear:  I'm not calling you a jerk.  I'm calling your actions jerky (so to speak).  It's just shorthand for that generally uncivil tone you've adopted in most of your Talk page contributions. Whether you personally are a jerk or not is entirely unknown to me and irrelevant to OrthodoxWiki.
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: Hi! Thanks for all your work. The wiki was long overdue for an upgrade (c.f. [[OrthodoxWiki:News|news]] )... I tried first running 1.27, and then 1.26. Turns out that hitcounters were [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T120216 removed]] from core in MW 1.26, so I've moved the site back to 1.25 and added the [[mw:Extension:HitCounters|HitCounter extension]], so we should be ok moving forward. Let me see what I can do about recovering those edits. (It was a question of reverting before many edits were made or losing the hitcounter history, going back to 2004...) — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 18:10, May 11, 2016 (UTC) — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 18:10, May 11, 2016 (UTC)
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: ...and please do let me know if you see any other issues.
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::No problem!  :) I'm just kind of noticing the differencesI got a whole bunch of server errors for a couple minutes there, but I'm sure that was from the upgrade (I don't get them anymore either).  I am determined to get the counter on the front page to 4900 (and hopefully beyond that!)
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:::How does [[Bulgarian_Eastern_Orthodox_Diocese_of_the_USA,_Canada_and_Australia|this]] look?
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::::Awesome!  Thank you!  :) [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 20:26, May 11, 2016 (UTC)
  
: As always, I am of course willing to submit to whatever judgment Fr. John has regarding all this.
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== How can I submit my sandbox page for publication on Orthodox Wiki? ==
  
: BTW, I restored Fr. John's [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&diff=prev&oldid=67055 earlier comment] which you edited out when you de-archived this part of his Talk page. In case you weren't aware, it is entirely uncool (i.e., might well be considered "jerky," "uncivil," etc.) to eliminate other's Talk page posts.  &mdash;[[User:ASDamick|<font size="3.5" color="green" face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">Fr. Andrew</font>]] <sup>[[User_talk:ASDamick|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/ASDamick|<font color="black">contribs</font>]] <font face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">('''[[User:ASDamick/Wiki-philosophy|THINK!]]''')</font></small> 13:02, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
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Hello Father John,
 +
I have created a page on the Nuns of Shamordino of Solovki Prison and Vorkuta Gulag. I would like to submit it for publication. How can I do that once the page has been created in Sandbox?
  
:: Andrew Damick, the more times you use the word "jerk" in this context, the more silly it makes you look. You made a mistake using the word in the first place, and you have let yourself down by using it. I advise you to stop wriggling around with fatuous qualifications, which are to your further discredit. [[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] 13:52, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
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Thanks very much. Robert
  
::I'm not sure "jerk" is helpful here -- might be better just to point out exactly what you mean by uncivil behavior. There is a learning curve in getting acclimated to the wiki... but I haven't reviewed every comment made... Maybe for now it's best just to break things up and go from there? — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 18:01, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
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[[User:Relic67|Relic67]] ([[User talk:Relic67|talk]]) 18:14, August 13, 2016 (UTC)
  
::: I'm not especially in love with the word ''jerk'' or phrase ''act like a jerk'', so it doesn't particularly matter to me.
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: Sorry, Father! I had forgotten to leave my contact details using the four tildes. Hope you can answer my question now. Thank you. [[User:Relic67|Relic67]] ([[User talk:Relic67|talk]]) 18:25, August 13, 2016 (UTC)
  
::: In terms of specifics of what I mean by "uncivil behavior," I have in mind mainly what has been posted by [[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] on [[Talk:Responses to OCA autocephaly]], but also on [[Talk:John (Zizioulas) of Pergamon]] and my Talk page.  Particular instances include referring to [[User:Cebactokpatop|Cebactokpatop]] as a [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:John_%28Zizioulas%29_of_Pergamon&diff=prev&oldid=65993 "thug"] and possessing a [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:John_%28Zizioulas%29_of_Pergamon&diff=prev&oldid=65982"beligerent theological illiteracy"] and to yours truly as possessing [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Responses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=prev&oldid=66449 "Anti-Greek Madness,"] a [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:ASDamick&diff=prev&oldid=67058 "passionate inability to control himself,"], that I am a [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Responses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=prev&oldid=66449 "boy,"] and (what really is my personal favorite) that I [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:ASDamick&diff=prev&oldid=67058 "lack the linguistic facility to do anything other than descend into petty name-calling."]  (This is most remarkable to me, I suppose, because I will now forever associate the word ''thug'' on the wiki with this editor.)  My edits are also apparently drawn from a [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Responses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=prev&oldid=66481 "deeper internal problem within the Antiochian Archdiocese"] (since I don't think that ''Greek Orthodox'' is the best term to describe the article on OCA autocephaly).
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== Ro.OrthodoxWiki.org ==
  
::: That this anonymous gent has also decided to refer to me solely by my legal name and that he is lecturing me on the nature of the priesthood might also be construed as "uncivil" by some, but I take all that as par for the course. I can't even remember a time when someone didn't like what I said to them on the wiki and '''didn't''' attach with his rejoinders a question of my ordination, canonicity, or ability to execute my office (none of which have anything in particular to do with OrthodoxWiki).
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Thank you very much! I requested only "administrator" permissions, but I see that I got more than I asked for. I hope not to disappoint anyone. God help us! --[[User:Sîmbotin|Sîmbotin]] 05:32, November 10, 2016 (UTC)
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::Thanks for your work Sîmbotin. Actually, you were made a "bureaucrat" which is a funny name, but allows you to administrate users, particularly on RO. God bless, — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 09:19, November 10, 2016 (UTC)
  
::: So, them's the partic'lars of what I mean by "uncivil behavior" (or what my mama used to call "acting like a jerk").  &mdash;[[User:ASDamick|<font size="3.5" color="green" face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">Fr. Andrew</font>]] <sup>[[User_talk:ASDamick|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/ASDamick|<font color="black">contribs</font>]] <font face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">('''[[User:ASDamick/Wiki-philosophy|THINK!]]''')</font></small> 18:42, May 29, 2008 (UTC)
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== Invitation to a Conversation ==
  
:::: A few points:
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Fr John, I have left a lengthy question about contraception and the Theology of the Body over at [[Talk:Birth Control and Contraception#The_Theology_of_the_Body]]. I've benefited from what you have contributed in that talk section. I am reaching out in good faith to see what I can learn from other people. If you have any comments, either public or private, they would be very welcome.
::::# I did not say you possessed "anti-Greek madness"; as I have already made clear to you, I said that it was anti-Greek madness [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk%3AResponses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=66481&oldid=66471 to refuse to recognise that the Patriarchates of Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, etc. are all Greek Orthodox patriarchates].
 
::::# I did not call you a "boy"; I said that [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk%3AResponses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=66449&oldid=66446 "boys will be boys"]; see the context and the meaning is evident.
 
::::# I did not say your edits were drawn from a deeper internal problem within the Antiochian Archdiocese. I said that the fact that converts within the Antiochian Archdiocese did not think of themselves or the Antiochian Patriarchate was reflective of [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Responses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=prev&oldid=66481 a deeper internal problem within the Antiochian Archdiocese - how does it maintain the historic identity of the Antiochian Patriarchate (which is Greek Orthodox) when it has such a large number of culturally Protestant converts who, for various reasons, don't want to be thought of as 'Greek Orthodox'?]
 
:::: From even a quick glance at what I actually said, it is evident that you are misreporting and distorting my comments. Not clever, and not entirely honest.
 
:::: I have warned you previously to [http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk%3AResponses_to_OCA_autocephaly&diff=66717&oldid=66706 get your facts straight]. It would have been better had you heeded that warning.
 
:::: It was silly of you to use the word "jerk", and it is even sillier each time you reuse the word. Such language is inappropriate for a member of the clergy.
 
:::: All in all, I find your conduct here rather sad.
 
:::: [[User:Seminarist|Seminarist]] 00:08, May 30, 2008 (UTC)
 

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Changes for the morning of May 11, 2016

You're probably still working on this, but it looks like the changes I made to pages this morning were lost. A couple of them were minor, but I did a significant wikification/edit of one of the pages Bulgarian Eastern Orthodox Diocese of the USA, Canada and Australia. Any chance this can be restored? (P.S. Thank you for all your hard work!) Katjuscha (talk) 18:05, May 11, 2016 (UTC)

Hi! Thanks for all your work. The wiki was long overdue for an upgrade (c.f. news )... I tried first running 1.27, and then 1.26. Turns out that hitcounters were removed] from core in MW 1.26, so I've moved the site back to 1.25 and added the HitCounter extension, so we should be ok moving forward. Let me see what I can do about recovering those edits. (It was a question of reverting before many edits were made or losing the hitcounter history, going back to 2004...) — FrJohn (talk) 18:10, May 11, 2016 (UTC) — FrJohn (talk) 18:10, May 11, 2016 (UTC)
...and please do let me know if you see any other issues.
No problem!  :) I'm just kind of noticing the differences. I got a whole bunch of server errors for a couple minutes there, but I'm sure that was from the upgrade (I don't get them anymore either). I am determined to get the counter on the front page to 4900 (and hopefully beyond that!)
How does this look?
Awesome! Thank you!  :) Katjuscha (talk) 20:26, May 11, 2016 (UTC)

How can I submit my sandbox page for publication on Orthodox Wiki?

Hello Father John, I have created a page on the Nuns of Shamordino of Solovki Prison and Vorkuta Gulag. I would like to submit it for publication. How can I do that once the page has been created in Sandbox?

Thanks very much. Robert

Relic67 (talk) 18:14, August 13, 2016 (UTC)

Sorry, Father! I had forgotten to leave my contact details using the four tildes. Hope you can answer my question now. Thank you. Relic67 (talk) 18:25, August 13, 2016 (UTC)

Ro.OrthodoxWiki.org

Thank you very much! I requested only "administrator" permissions, but I see that I got more than I asked for. I hope not to disappoint anyone. God help us! --Sîmbotin 05:32, November 10, 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for your work Sîmbotin. Actually, you were made a "bureaucrat" which is a funny name, but allows you to administrate users, particularly on RO. God bless, — FrJohn (talk) 09:19, November 10, 2016 (UTC)

Invitation to a Conversation

Fr John, I have left a lengthy question about contraception and the Theology of the Body over at Talk:Birth Control and Contraception#The_Theology_of_the_Body. I've benefited from what you have contributed in that talk section. I am reaching out in good faith to see what I can learn from other people. If you have any comments, either public or private, they would be very welcome.