Difference between revisions of "OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza"

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* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 3|Archive 3]], Oct 2005 – Aug 2006 (moved from [http://www.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page&oldid=37962 Talk:Main Page])
 
* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 3|Archive 3]], Oct 2005 – Aug 2006 (moved from [http://www.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Talk:Main_Page&oldid=37962 Talk:Main Page])
 
* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 4|Archive 4]], Aug 2006 – Dec 2006 (2006 Trapeza archive)
 
* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 4|Archive 4]], Aug 2006 – Dec 2006 (2006 Trapeza archive)
* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 5|Archive 5]], Dec 2006 – November 2008
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* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 5|Archive 5]], Dec 2006 – Nov 2008
* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 6|Archive 6]], Nov 2008 – March 2011
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* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 6|Archive 6]], Nov 2008 – Mar 2011
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* [[OrthodoxWiki:Trapeza/Archive 7|Archive 7]], May 2011 – Jan 2015
  
 
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== Holy Trinity Metafor ==
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== a hello on a new page ==
  
Hello,  
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So...  My goal is to get to 4900 on unique articles before too long.  I'd definitely eventually like to see the 4 flip to a 5...  :)  There's a lot of stuff out there that could be written about.  Take care!  [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 20:28, May 11, 2016 (UTC)
  
Reading about the material universe, noticed that there are 3 infinities (or mysteries) that define our world:
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: Sounds great, [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]]! Please note this previous discussion on [[OrthodoxWiki:Administrators#Eliminating_directory_articles|Eliminating_directory_articles]] - there is certainly room for overviews and histories, but a major problem with making a directory of parishes is that things can get out of date very quickly. — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk])
 +
::Understood.  :)  As far as the Bulgarian diocese page, I figured I'd just clean it up a bit since it's been sitting there with some VERY old information (priests' names, for example) for a couple of years.  As it was a priest in the diocese referenced who posted the info in the first place, I didn't necessarily want to just clear out the whole thing. Hope that reasoning makes some sense.  :) [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 01:35, May 12, 2016 (UTC)
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:::Certainly, thanks! And again, background / historical info is great. — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk])
  
1. --- The immensity of space-time, the boundless universe than nobody can say for sure how big it is, where it ends. Sure there are some theories that are accepted by most scientists, but also big anomalies if you apply the theory, that need to be corrected with inventions such as "dark matter" or "string theory" to fill in for obvious gaps.
 
  
2. --- The "small infinity" or mystery of the subatomic universe. We split the atoms in so many sub-particles, and the latest belief is that in fact all the matter is a concentration of energy. But where does matter end and pure energy begins?
 
  
I may be overcomplicating here, but it's just so poetic to notice how the science laws of the big universe and the small universe are in disagreement with each-other when it comes to apply the macrocosmos laws to microcosmos or the other way around, as if God intended things to be mysterious and impenetrable for the human mind.
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== A note on something I noticed ==
  
3. --- The infinite complexity of life and intelligence. The connections in our brain are said to be more than all the stars in the universe. But how can this complexity come to be in only 4 billon years since our Earth is said to exist. This level of organisation of matter, first level: life, second level: intelligent life are both just unconceivable by science.  
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Fr. John, the updates look great, thank you for the hard work!  :)  I've noticed a couple of little hiccups, but it looks like most of them have been smoothed out (the captcha acting silly, for one). This isn't a big thing at all, but under "Special Pages", the "active users list" doesn't work anymore. It always shows no active users, and a note that it's a cached page that might be up to 101 days old. (This number gets bigger all the time.) I think somewhere this stat must still be working, because I think on the statistics page, it does show the actual number of active users, but when you click on that, it brings you to the page that shows none. Hope you are well!  :)  [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 13:05, May 19, 2016 (UTC)
  
I want to ask you: could these 3 "infinities" be a reflection of the Holy Trinity in the material world? Or what is the theological view about those mysteries?
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: Hmm... there is this bug report: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T89027. I also tried clearing caches, running the Special Pages update script... didn't work. Since this is reflected on [[Special:RecentChanges|RecentChanges]], I don't think it is critical, but I am glad you pointed it out.
  
Thank you
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== author credits? ==
Mihai
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 +
I was under the impression that articles on this wiki (other than protected pages that are reprinted by permission) are not supposed to have 'authorship' mentioned in the article.  A couple months ago, I removed something like this from the article [[Holy Trinity Church (San Francisco, California)]], but now the "author" has put the credit to himself as author back in.  He's also given himself credit on the article [[Annunciation Greek Orthodox Cathedral (San Francisco, California)]], but at least he references back to an article he wrote that was posted elsewhere on the internet.  Not being a sysop or anything, I don't want to get into an edit war here.  [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 02:09, May 23, 2016 (UTC)
  
== New category ==
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:The author trail is preserved in page history, and not typically in attribution on the page. I'm not too worried about this, but, especially, if someone else substantially revises/addes to the articles, I have no problem with them remove the author attribution either. By submitting content to the wiki, they have agreed to license it according to [[OrthodoxWiki:Copyright|our copyright policy]].
I was thinking of adding a category to be called '''"Propitiatory Offerings"''' where all of the things that are offered to God can be grouped together, inluding: [[Artoklasia]], [[Kollyva]], [[Proskomedia]], [[Molieben]], [[Incense]], [[Myrrh]], [[Votive Offerings]], and things of this nature. Propitiatory Offerings in the Old Testament consisted mainly of sacrifices; in the Orthodox Church we have this new array of elements. Any ideas or comments? Is it accurate to describe it this way? Thanks and cheers. [[User:Angellight 888|Angellight 888]] 20:34, May 18, 2011 (UTC)
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: Propitiation is a problematic concept for Orthodoxy and one I wouldn't be willing to endorse (e.g., I would never say, "We offer up incense as a propitiation to God").  That said, though, I've never heard of these things really being grouped together in traditional Orthodox writings.  &mdash;[[User:ASDamick|<font size="3.5" color="green" face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">Fr. Andrew</font>]] <sup>[[User_talk:ASDamick|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/ASDamick|<font color="black">contribs</font>]] <font face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">('''[[User:ASDamick/Wiki-philosophy|THINK!]]''')</font></small> 14:05, May 19, 2011 (UTC)
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==St. Ioann Listvinnik?==
  
:: Thanks for the clarification Father, cheers, [[User:Angellight 888|Angellight 888]] 14:09, May 19, 2011 (UTC)
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I've been reading a bit about historic churches in Alaska, and I saw mentioned that in Tigalda (Tigalda Island, perhaps), a church was consecrated in 1844, dedicated to St. Ioann Listvinnik.  Anybody know if this is correct or that it might be in error?  Thanks.  :)  [[User:Katjuscha|Katjuscha]] ([[User talk:Katjuscha|talk]]) 01:13, June 6, 2016 (UTC)
  
== Calendar Days ==
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Question: 
Greetings. I had a look over at Wikipedia at their Orthodox "Calendar day" pages, and I liked how the pages were set up; instead of a block paragraph, with all the daily Saints blocked together as we have them here, they list them in a neatly ordered list (with bullets). This list could even be arranged chronologically for that particular day (i.e. with the oldest-in-time Saints listed first, the most recent saint for that day listed last).
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Here is an example from Wikipedia for [[w:June 4 (Eastern Orthodox liturgics)|JUNE 4th]]. I would like to go into all of our Calendar Day pages for the entire year (all 365 days), and make the change form paragraph to list form, for ease of reading and better visual (and chronological) access. Would this be okay / sound good / any objections? (I don't mind doing the work)Cheers, [[User:Angellight 888|Angellight 888]] 11:52, June 4, 2011 (UTC)
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When it comes to posting biographical information, should we have some sort of policy shying away from posting too much information about living people, especially Americans, due to identity theft issues?  For people born between 1970-2011, and in particular from about 1987-2011, when you have some combination of family name, birthplace, and exact date of birth, it becomes easier to guess social security numbers, especially if someone was born in a state with a smaller population. I understand that much of this information is publicly available; I just would rather not have OrthodoxWiki be the "to-go" place for people looking to steal the identities of well-known Orthodox personalitiesMy general policy has been to not post exact dates of birth for people in this age range, being as that seems to be the least relevant item for OrthodoxWiki, and probably the most sensitive for identity theft, but then I see someone here who keeps putting that information back up.
  
== Twitter feed showing drug spam ==
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*[http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/06/AR2009070602955.html Washington Post article about guessing Social Security Numbers]
 +
*[https://www.ssa.gov/employer/randomization.html The new system of assigning Social Security Numbers] Social Security Administration official site
  
I saw the following in my twitter feed:
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: Not sure about the SSNs, but I do think in general we should exercise some discretion in posting details about living people. Wikipedia practice can be a guide here. Obviously, things like biographies and general biographical sketches are fine, especially when this information is not controversial and someone is a public figure already. — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 17:53, August 23, 2016 (UTC)
 
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FYI.
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[[User:JonathansCornerCom|JonathansCornerCom]] 12:11, August 17, 2011 (UTC)
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: It's been fixed.  &mdash;[[User:ASDamick|<font size="3.5" color="green" face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">Fr. Andrew</font>]] <sup>[[User_talk:ASDamick|<font color="red">talk</font>]]</sup> <small>[[Special:Contributions/ASDamick|<font color="black">contribs</font>]] <font face="Adobe Garamond Pro, Garamond, Georgia, Times New Roman">('''[[User:ASDamick/Wiki-philosophy|THINK!]]''')</font></small> 18:20, August 17, 2011 (UTC)
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Thanks! Great!
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[[User:JonathansCornerCom|JonathansCornerCom]] 22:41, August 17, 2011 (UTC)
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== List of Enlighterners/Illuminators/Equals-to-the-Apostles ==
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I realize that the purpose of the wiki structure is to allow anyone to edit. I hope OW will forgive my impertinence in merely suggesting (as opposed to creating myself) that it would be useful to have a list (or lists) corresponding to the different saint titles at [[ illuminator ]].
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I've thought of this because an LDS poster on a message board I frequent challenged non-LDS to name five of our own missionaries "whose exploits rival that of the LDS missionary work."
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: I think the OW category 'Missionaries' covers this with an extensive list. An article over a list of missionaries would be rather long! [[User:Wsk|Wsk]] 01:22, September 18, 2011 (UTC)
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: Thanks for the response WSK! I'm not seeing the category for 'Missionaries'...what am I missing? [[User:Jkotinek|Jkotinek]] 19:57, September 19, 2011 (UTC)
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: NM. Found it. = ) [[User:Jkotinek|Jkotinek]] 20:00, September 19, 2011 (UTC)
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== Confesion ==
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Where may I find info abour Confession?  I did a search for that subject & coldn't fnd it.  After a long absence from Church, I returned in February 2012. I've had four o five cnfessions snce then.  Every tme I try to confess, I'm often fogettng sins.  Dad told me it's okay to say "I can't recall others, but I read that it's not ok
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May 12, 2012
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Brooklyn, NY
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Thank you Irene Nikolsky
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:: I think it's good to talk with a priest, but also you might find some helpful resources at http://stspress.com/ or http://svspress.com - — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk]) 16:34, May 12, 2012 (HST)
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== Basic Information ==
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Is there a website that helps people and/or teenagers with basic Q&As about our religion?  I have teen son, who was baptized Orthodox.  Because my church is in Russian he doesn't want to go.  I thought if  I could find basic info for him, then he'd believe me that there are English speaking Eastern Orthodox members.
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Thank you,
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Irene Nikolsky
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Broolyn, NY
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:: Greetings Irene. Of course, there are A LOT of English-speaking (and non-Russian) Orthodox people -- For Q+A, you might try http://orthodoxanswers.org/ -- — [[User:FrJohn|<b>FrJohn</b>]] ([http://orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=User_talk:FrJohn&action=edit&section=new talk])
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== Orthodox wiki stats ==
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Is there a way to look at statistics for various pages by day, week, month, and year? --[[User:Kalvesmaki|Kalvesmaki]] 16:03, May 17, 2012 (HST)
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==Diocese evolution in North America==
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One aspect that I have had in preparing my contributions to Orthodoxwiki concerns an accurate presentation of the ecclesiastical structure of the Orthodox in North America. While sources concerning the earliest century, notably in the OCA 1975 publication, give a fairly clear picture of the founding of dioceses and vicariates, the last century is blurred.
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Various sources seem to present a good picture of the history of the structure of the Greek and Antiochian diocese, but the picture within the Russian based organizations gets blurred as the twentieth century progressed. The history of the Russian mission to North America seems clear to the first decade of the twentieth century when the Vicariates of Alaska and Brooklyn were formed. As hierarchs were installed with sees named Canada, Pittsburgh, Chicago, Winnipeg, Montreal, San Francisco, Detroit, Boston, and others through the time of the Metropolia, apparently as Vicariates of the North American Diocese that commonly was called the Metropolia. The formation of any of these Vicariates as Dioceses came apparently only after the granting of autocephaly to the the "Metropolia" and, thus, bishops of these sees prior to 1970 were apparently "titular/vicar/assistant bishops, not diocesan bishops. A question in my mind is, were the bishops of the "ethnic dioceses" vicars or ruling bishops?
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The picture for bishops and dioceses of ROCOR in North America is less clear as to when the "titular" sees ceased being "titular" and may have become real dioceses.
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Recent updates to articles about North American dioceses makes necessary a clear understanding of the evolution of the North American ecclesiastical structure so that Orthodoxwiki articles don't imply existence of dioceses before they came into existence. 
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The above is my assumption of the history of the development of the dioceses in North America. Sources/references and text within articles that clarifies the evolution of the North American structure are needed to assure accuracy in the articles. [[User:Wsk|Wsk]] 05:07, September 12, 2012 (HST)
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== GOARCH link URLs format ==
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One thing I'm constantly running into (and correcting as I go along) is the format of URLs leading to GOARCH's Online Chapel Saints pages being out of date (and leading to the "that page doesn't exist" message). They have changed formats at least once (maybe twice based on what I've seen here), and unfortunately, they haven't set any redirects, whether programmatically or via HTTP 301. (I've thought about contacting them about it, but haven't gotten up the nerve to do so)
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Example:
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* (old, broken way): http://goarch.org/en/chapel/saints/1180
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* (current way): http://goarch.org/chapel/saints_view?contentid=1180
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I've pondered a bit about what should be done here. Obviously, one thing -- which I'm already doing -- is making the necessary correction every time I see one on a page. However, that's just a few out of the potentially ''hundreds'' of outdated links there could be. Something else could be developing a bot that would search all pages and update the links automatically. I don't know ''how'' to do that, but I know ''what'' they'd need to do. Anyways, I just wanted to bring it to everyone's (in particular the sysops') attention, as this is (warning: assumptions lie ahead) a widespread problem, and a potential hindrance from people getting the proper information (i.e. not knowing how to get to the right URL, or just giving up and saying "oh well, another bad link"). It may seem like a small thing, but it definitely means a lot to me, as I would hate for people to not be able to easily get to the information they need.
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If I can help, other than my edit-one-when-I-see-it method, just let me know. [[User:Paharwell|Phil Harwell (paharwell)]] 08:36, December 11, 2012 (HST)
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Latest revision as of 17:53, August 23, 2016

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Add new post

a hello on a new page

So... My goal is to get to 4900 on unique articles before too long. I'd definitely eventually like to see the 4 flip to a 5...  :) There's a lot of stuff out there that could be written about. Take care! Katjuscha (talk) 20:28, May 11, 2016 (UTC)

Sounds great, Katjuscha! Please note this previous discussion on Eliminating_directory_articles - there is certainly room for overviews and histories, but a major problem with making a directory of parishes is that things can get out of date very quickly. — FrJohn (talk)
Understood.  :) As far as the Bulgarian diocese page, I figured I'd just clean it up a bit since it's been sitting there with some VERY old information (priests' names, for example) for a couple of years. As it was a priest in the diocese referenced who posted the info in the first place, I didn't necessarily want to just clear out the whole thing. Hope that reasoning makes some sense.  :) Katjuscha (talk) 01:35, May 12, 2016 (UTC)
Certainly, thanks! And again, background / historical info is great. — FrJohn (talk)


A note on something I noticed

Fr. John, the updates look great, thank you for the hard work!  :) I've noticed a couple of little hiccups, but it looks like most of them have been smoothed out (the captcha acting silly, for one). This isn't a big thing at all, but under "Special Pages", the "active users list" doesn't work anymore. It always shows no active users, and a note that it's a cached page that might be up to 101 days old. (This number gets bigger all the time.) I think somewhere this stat must still be working, because I think on the statistics page, it does show the actual number of active users, but when you click on that, it brings you to the page that shows none. Hope you are well!  :) Katjuscha (talk) 13:05, May 19, 2016 (UTC)

Hmm... there is this bug report: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T89027. I also tried clearing caches, running the Special Pages update script... didn't work. Since this is reflected on RecentChanges, I don't think it is critical, but I am glad you pointed it out.

author credits?

I was under the impression that articles on this wiki (other than protected pages that are reprinted by permission) are not supposed to have 'authorship' mentioned in the article. A couple months ago, I removed something like this from the article Holy Trinity Church (San Francisco, California), but now the "author" has put the credit to himself as author back in. He's also given himself credit on the article Annunciation Greek Orthodox Cathedral (San Francisco, California), but at least he references back to an article he wrote that was posted elsewhere on the internet. Not being a sysop or anything, I don't want to get into an edit war here. Katjuscha (talk) 02:09, May 23, 2016 (UTC)

The author trail is preserved in page history, and not typically in attribution on the page. I'm not too worried about this, but, especially, if someone else substantially revises/addes to the articles, I have no problem with them remove the author attribution either. By submitting content to the wiki, they have agreed to license it according to our copyright policy.

St. Ioann Listvinnik?

I've been reading a bit about historic churches in Alaska, and I saw mentioned that in Tigalda (Tigalda Island, perhaps), a church was consecrated in 1844, dedicated to St. Ioann Listvinnik. Anybody know if this is correct or that it might be in error? Thanks.  :) Katjuscha (talk) 01:13, June 6, 2016 (UTC)

Question:

When it comes to posting biographical information, should we have some sort of policy shying away from posting too much information about living people, especially Americans, due to identity theft issues? For people born between 1970-2011, and in particular from about 1987-2011, when you have some combination of family name, birthplace, and exact date of birth, it becomes easier to guess social security numbers, especially if someone was born in a state with a smaller population. I understand that much of this information is publicly available; I just would rather not have OrthodoxWiki be the "to-go" place for people looking to steal the identities of well-known Orthodox personalities. My general policy has been to not post exact dates of birth for people in this age range, being as that seems to be the least relevant item for OrthodoxWiki, and probably the most sensitive for identity theft, but then I see someone here who keeps putting that information back up.

Not sure about the SSNs, but I do think in general we should exercise some discretion in posting details about living people. Wikipedia practice can be a guide here. Obviously, things like biographies and general biographical sketches are fine, especially when this information is not controversial and someone is a public figure already. — FrJohn (talk) 17:53, August 23, 2016 (UTC)