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Talk:Vlad the Impaler

2,662 bytes added, 06:22, July 29, 2009
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::::By all means, check with the Romanians. I've seen icons of him, but this could easily be a fringe thing (like the similar ones of St. Nikolai Rasputin). Although it brings up an interesting problem: in case of disagreement between two Orthodox groups, one of them perhaps much smaller than the other, what is the policy?
 
:::::Who is Nikolai Rasputin?? Are you talking about [[Gregory Efimovich Rasputin]]! He certainly is NOT a saint! [[User:Wsk|Wsk]] 13:20, July 28, 2009 (UTC)
 
::::::Whoops. Right, I mean Grigory. Well, YOU feel sure that he was "certainly" not a saint, but other Orthodox people claim that he is. http://www.timboucher.com/journal/2005/10/01/rasputin-to-become-a-saint/ Who's to decide?[[User:Zla'od|Zla'od]] 03:29, July 29, 2009 (UTC)
::::If he was Orthodox, and if he died in battle against the Turks, then "Great-Martyr" would be appropriate, no? But I admit that all this is far from my area of knowledge.[[User:Zla'od|Zla'od]] 01:47, July 28, 2009 (UTC)
::::: Hello. [http://www.patriarh.ro/Index/sfintiromani.php| Here is a list of romanian saints,] but in romanian. [http://www.univ-ovidius.ro/btcassian/SINAXAR_ORTODOX/main.htm| Here is another list of romanian saints, in romanian language.] You can check by name, it is not difficul. [http://www.pomog.org/index.html?http://www.pomog.org/saintlist.shtml| Here is a list of saints from a ROCOR church]. You will not find him, because he is not a saint. This article is a vandalism. [[User:Maraamu|Maraamu]] 06:59, July 28, 2009 (UTC)
::::: Hello. [http://www.patriarh.ro/Index/sfintiromani.php| Here Are you sure that this list is a list of romanian exhaustive? As far as I know, saintsdo not need to be formally canonized, as in the Catholic church,] but in romanian. [http://www.univare often recognized as the result of grass-ovidiusroots support.ro/btcassian/SINAXAR_ORTODOX/main.htm| Here Whether Dracula is another list an example of romanian saintsthis, in romanian language.] You can check by nameI do not know, it is not difficul. [http://www.pomog.org/index.html?http://www.pomog.org/saintlist.shtml| Here is a list of saints from a ROCOR church]. You will not find but assuming that at least some Romanians support himas such, while others oppose, because he what is not a saint. This article is a vandalism. this site to do?[[User:MaraamuZla'od|MaraamuZla'od]] 0603:5929, July 2829, 2009 (UTC)
::::A person who happens to be Orthodox, killed in battle by a person who happens to be non-Orthodox, is not automatically a Great-Martyr (or, afaik, any other kind of martyr). He wasn't killed for his religion, and certainly not tortured. An example of a Great-Martyr would be St George, who was a soldier, yes; but he was tortured and killed for being a Christian by his own government. &mdash; by [[User:Pistevo|<font color="green">Pιs</font><font color="gold">τévο</font>]] <sup>''[[User talk:Pistevo|<font color="blue">talk</font>]]'' ''[[User talk:Pistevo/dev/null|<font color="red">complaints</font>]]''</sup> at 12:33, July 28, 2009 (UTC)
 
:::::Well, he was "killed for his religion" in the sense that he died while fighting a war to protect it. But I was unsure of the terminology myself, and defer to your expertise on the matter.
 
:::::What about all those churches and monasteries he founded? Could we call him a patron of Orthodoxy, along the lines of Constantine? [[User:Zla&#39;od|Zla&#39;od]] 03:29, July 29, 2009 (UTC)
 
::::In case of disagreement between Orthodox groups, we run with what the local Holy Synod has/has not said. If there is notable disagreement (which isn't the case here), we document that. We're an encyclopaedia, not a news source.
::::Who's to decide? Holy Synods. Certainly not OrthodoxWiki. If a person hasn't been glorified as a saint, then they are not listed among the saints - that seems almost tautological.
::::He wasn't killed for his religion in particular. Religion tends to be secondary in war, and at this point I've no reason to believe that this one was any different to, say, all the wars between the Byzantine Empire (Orthodox) and their various opponents (usually not Orthodox). No one's suggesting Paleologus should be glorified, either.
::::We aren't calling him anything new. Constantine was glorified by the Church. Other rulers were, e.g. Tsar Nicholas II (due largely to his murder). This one was, and is, not. That's really as far as OW goes. If there are fringe groups saying that he is a saint, then these can be documented, but he is not considered to be a saint by the Church Militant at this time. &mdash; by [[User:Pistevo|<font color="green">Pιs</font><font color="gold">τévο</font>]] <sup>''[[User talk:Pistevo|<font color="blue">talk</font>]]'' ''[[User talk:Pistevo/dev/null|<font color="red">complaints</font>]]''</sup> at 06:22, July 29, 2009 (UTC)
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