Talk:Baptists

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(New page: == Mistaken Ideas About Baptists == I realize that this is an Eastern Orthodox wiki and that the Orthodox regard all other Christian groups as "heretics." But a number of things alleged i...)
 
 
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I realize that this is an Eastern Orthodox wiki and that the Orthodox regard all other Christian groups as "heretics." But a number of things alleged in this article were factually inaccurate regarding Baptists. Baptists and other evangelical Christians do, in fact, believe in a concept similar to theosis, which they call sanctification. They also do not believe that morally bankrupt individuals receive grace just because they have an intellectual belief in Christ. They believe that improved life and moral transformation are essential proofs of one's salvation, although salvation itself is purely an act of God's grace. Therefore, I felt free to correct this article. I want to remind the writers of this wiki that even if your beliefs that your church is only true one turn out to be true and the rest of us all go to burn in Hell for not throwing ourselves at the feet of your bishops to grovel in submission, God will not look kindly on those who fudge facts. Surely, the fact that we disagree on church government, the role of the Bible, etc. is enough to earn us the label "heretics" without your making up false accusations of moral laxness. Frankly, the vast majority of Orthodox are mere "cultural Orthodox" who think they're going to Heaven due to mere sacramental observance, without any real Christian virtue in their lives. You're hardly a tradition with the moral clout to throw stones at Baptists, Pentecostals, evangelicals and other Christians who generally take their faith and morality far more seriously than most of you.--[[User:ManicBrit|ManicBrit]] 01:29, December 1, 2008 (UTC)
 
I realize that this is an Eastern Orthodox wiki and that the Orthodox regard all other Christian groups as "heretics." But a number of things alleged in this article were factually inaccurate regarding Baptists. Baptists and other evangelical Christians do, in fact, believe in a concept similar to theosis, which they call sanctification. They also do not believe that morally bankrupt individuals receive grace just because they have an intellectual belief in Christ. They believe that improved life and moral transformation are essential proofs of one's salvation, although salvation itself is purely an act of God's grace. Therefore, I felt free to correct this article. I want to remind the writers of this wiki that even if your beliefs that your church is only true one turn out to be true and the rest of us all go to burn in Hell for not throwing ourselves at the feet of your bishops to grovel in submission, God will not look kindly on those who fudge facts. Surely, the fact that we disagree on church government, the role of the Bible, etc. is enough to earn us the label "heretics" without your making up false accusations of moral laxness. Frankly, the vast majority of Orthodox are mere "cultural Orthodox" who think they're going to Heaven due to mere sacramental observance, without any real Christian virtue in their lives. You're hardly a tradition with the moral clout to throw stones at Baptists, Pentecostals, evangelicals and other Christians who generally take their faith and morality far more seriously than most of you.--[[User:ManicBrit|ManicBrit]] 01:29, December 1, 2008 (UTC)
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:ManicBrit, thank you for your contributions to OrthodoxWiki.  The first part of your contribution to this talk page seems well thought-out; thank you for this information, clarification and edit to the article.  Perhaps you would be able to provide some sources for this - the Wikipedia page on [[w:Sanctification|Sanctification]] does not mention Baptists, and the page on [[w:Baptists|Baptists]] does not mention Sanctification.  As you pointed out, we are not Baptists, and I think that it is important to talk about opposing beliefs rather than strawman arguments from either side - and that a Wiki is the ideal place for speedy corrections to be done.
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:Which brings me to the second part (and slight majority) of your talk page, which was not so well thought-out, factually accurate - even charitable.  Asserting that we believe that all those outside the Orthodox Church will go to hell, that bishops are to be grovelled at, that the previous revision of the article implied moral laxity, and the presence of nominal Christianity (as if it is something unique to Orthodoxy - !!) reduces the moral clout (!) of the Orthodox Church are, well, just that: assertions, based on faulty premises or faulty conclusions.  Feel free to retract them at your earliest convenience. &mdash; by [[User:Pistevo|<font color="green">Pιs</font><font color="gold">τévο</font>]] <sup>''[[User talk:Pistevo|<font color="blue">talk</font>]]'' ''[[User talk:Pistevo/dev/null|<font color="red">complaints</font>]]''</sup> at 01:47, December 3, 2008 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 18:47, December 2, 2008

Mistaken Ideas About Baptists

I realize that this is an Eastern Orthodox wiki and that the Orthodox regard all other Christian groups as "heretics." But a number of things alleged in this article were factually inaccurate regarding Baptists. Baptists and other evangelical Christians do, in fact, believe in a concept similar to theosis, which they call sanctification. They also do not believe that morally bankrupt individuals receive grace just because they have an intellectual belief in Christ. They believe that improved life and moral transformation are essential proofs of one's salvation, although salvation itself is purely an act of God's grace. Therefore, I felt free to correct this article. I want to remind the writers of this wiki that even if your beliefs that your church is only true one turn out to be true and the rest of us all go to burn in Hell for not throwing ourselves at the feet of your bishops to grovel in submission, God will not look kindly on those who fudge facts. Surely, the fact that we disagree on church government, the role of the Bible, etc. is enough to earn us the label "heretics" without your making up false accusations of moral laxness. Frankly, the vast majority of Orthodox are mere "cultural Orthodox" who think they're going to Heaven due to mere sacramental observance, without any real Christian virtue in their lives. You're hardly a tradition with the moral clout to throw stones at Baptists, Pentecostals, evangelicals and other Christians who generally take their faith and morality far more seriously than most of you.--ManicBrit 01:29, December 1, 2008 (UTC)

ManicBrit, thank you for your contributions to OrthodoxWiki. The first part of your contribution to this talk page seems well thought-out; thank you for this information, clarification and edit to the article. Perhaps you would be able to provide some sources for this - the Wikipedia page on Sanctification does not mention Baptists, and the page on Baptists does not mention Sanctification. As you pointed out, we are not Baptists, and I think that it is important to talk about opposing beliefs rather than strawman arguments from either side - and that a Wiki is the ideal place for speedy corrections to be done.
Which brings me to the second part (and slight majority) of your talk page, which was not so well thought-out, factually accurate - even charitable. Asserting that we believe that all those outside the Orthodox Church will go to hell, that bishops are to be grovelled at, that the previous revision of the article implied moral laxity, and the presence of nominal Christianity (as if it is something unique to Orthodoxy - !!) reduces the moral clout (!) of the Orthodox Church are, well, just that: assertions, based on faulty premises or faulty conclusions. Feel free to retract them at your earliest convenience. — by Pιsτévο talk complaints at 01:47, December 3, 2008 (UTC)
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